Chapter Blue
Tyra Valeriano, host of Chapter Blue, comes with 11 years of law enforcement experience and talks about mental health, self-care, work-life balance and more. Through honest conversations and personal experience, Chapter Blue allows for officers worldwide to share their stories, struggles, and successes both on and off duty and to give the public an insight to what the media has made into such a controversial profession. The podcast will establish the connection to the important topics and struggles in law enforcement and open up to all first responder roles in the new year to address how interchangeable the roles relate to the struggle. Join the conversation, because it’s long overdue!
Chapter Blue
Breaking the Silence: Carrie Matthews on Mental Health and Suicide in the Police Force
Carrie Matthews, a seasoned officer with 20 years in the Chicago Police Department, opens up about her life on the force. Growing up in a family rooted deeply in law enforcement, Carrie shares her unique perspective on the challenges that come with parenting as a police officer and growing up with a parent on the force. Her discussion about the importance of a support system beyond the uniform provides invaluable insights into maintaining a healthy work-life balance and keeping a well-rounded perspective in the face of daily demands.
Mental health is a critical topic that Carrie bravely addresses, shedding light on the emotional toll of policing. With personal stories, she shares the heartbreaking account of her father’s suicide after decades of service, bringing attention to the silent battles many officers face. This episode highlights the need to break the stigma surrounding mental health in law enforcement and stresses the importance of open dialogue and support systems for both officers and their families.
Communication emerges as a vital theme as Carrie discusses how expressing emotions and seeking support are important in dealing with grief and trauma. Her journey shows the power of human connections and empathy, encouraging officers to embrace vulnerability as a strength rather than a weakness. By challenging the typical "I'm fine" response, she advocates for genuine conversations that can help officers feel seen and heard, ultimately fostering a more compassionate and understanding environment within the law enforcement community.
Contact:
Instagram: @chicity_girl
LinkedIn: Carrie Matthews
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Welcome to Chapter Blue, the podcast where we discuss the world of law enforcement through an honest conversation on tough or controversial topics, real stories, perspectives and experience from officers all around the world. Whether you're here for insights on mental health, self-care, work-life balance, getting into law enforcement, getting out of law enforcement, or just trying to learn about personal and professional challenges officers face every day, you've come to the right place. I'm your host, tyra Valeriano, and whether I'm going solo or speaking with a guest, each episode will discuss different aspects of life behind the badge. Let's turn the page and step into Chapter Blue. Thank you to everyone for tuning in on this next episode of Chapter Blue.
Tyra Valeriano:I am privileged to welcome Carrie Matthews, who just celebrated 20 years with Chicago PD and she comes from a police family sharing her experience of what it was like to have parenting in law enforcement and growing up to follow the same career path. Today, carrie is going to share her story for the first time on a podcast, so I feel very honored to be the person she made the decision to share her most vulnerable moments with. Carrie's story is moving and raw, and it's based on struggles on mental health and suicide from the job and reminding us of the importance of changing the stigma. Hi Carrie, thank you so much for taking time out of your schedule to join me today. If you would give the listeners some more background about your law enforcement career and what you're doing today?
Carrie Matthews:Absolutely, and thank you very much for having me talk with you today. My name is Carrie Matthews. I am a 20-year veteran of the Chicago Police Department. I come from a family of police officers. My father was a police officer. My brother is a retired commander. My grandfather was a police officer, so it's definitely was in the blood. My mom we used to tease would say she's the only one at Thanksgiving without a gun, so it's definitely something that's your calling. I am married. My husband's a police officer. We actually met our first second day in college. We're friends for years and then got married later in life. I have two children a son at 16, a daughter that's 13. And I guess that's about it.
Tyra Valeriano:That's a long history of family in law enforcement. Do your kids want to become police officers?
Carrie Matthews:So, of course, like any children, they say it, but I try to sway them to. What I like to say is get a better job. Whatever they would choose to do, I would stand behind them. But with the climate that it is today, I would not advise it. But you never know, I don't want to take anything away from them. They could be great at it.
Tyra Valeriano:That's a really interesting perspective. I've also felt that way. I have little ones and I've had one tell me they wanted to be a police officer. But I think, as a parent and somebody who served in law enforcement and, as for you, still in law enforcement it is the climate that changes the perspective of wanting to encourage your child. Of course, we support whatever decision that they make, but it is very different than what it used to be.
Carrie Matthews:Absolutely different than what it used to be, absolutely. And growing up I did not. My father did not bring any of his stories home, like we didn't talk about it, so I never knew what he did, really, like I just knew he was a police officer and, you know, don't drink or do drugs because he'll find out, basically like he'll just know. And my husband and I we don't bring work home either, we don't talk Sometimes the funny things we may speak about, but normally there's no talk about it. Which was good when they were younger. But now, when the kids are older, in schools and the other kids of police officers are in those schools and classes, they seem to talk about some of the things police shootings, police suicides, car accidents which come up. And my theory is I'll never lie to my kids if they ask me a straight answer, but I'll never just come home and say a police officer was shot, killed today.
Tyra Valeriano:Right, what is it like being with the family? You know you have a big family of police officers. How is it outside of that? I mean, do you guys have friends that are not police officers and how is that relationship, because you come from such a long line of law enforcement?
Carrie Matthews:So to me it was something that was very important was to have what we call our civilian friends. Yes, I have friends within the department, amazing people that I've met through 20 years who are some very good close friends of mine. But I also keep myself even keeled with civilian friends moms, dads who we can go out and just have conversations about goofy things our kids did or things we want to do, and it's not all police talk. I really don't like to talk about police talk or police stories when I'm out and about. It's just something that I've always been like to tell the war stories. I don't do that, but I prefer just to. I really friends to me are people who have my back and support me, so that's who I really will surround myself with.
Tyra Valeriano:I'm interested to know what your experience as a police officer has been like. Number one you're a mom, so I want to hear how that transition was for you. When you were doing your career, you had kids and dealing with, of course, traumatic events, and knowing that both you and your husband are police officers and you have your family, how did you deal with that? How do you both deal with that and how do you, how do you, keep the family unit together? What's your best advice for those out there who have the same situation as you?
Carrie Matthews:Well, like as always, no marriage is perfect. We've definitely had our ups and downs, our good times. Bad times Before I got married is when I got on the job. So I got on the job in November of 2004. I was not married. I went through the academy. I busted my butt to prove that I needed to be there. I believe that it was something in my own head, but also in the reality of my dad and his partners, or his way of life with police officers when they first got on. You know that women shouldn't be on the job, they should be behind a desk, all that type of stuff. So I wanted to definitely show that I belong there and that I could do the job. So I busted my butt in the academy and I landed up being the valedictorian of the class, so number one, in academics, which I was happy about. But I thought that at the time that once you were number one, you got to pick the place where you could go in Chicago, what district, what area, and of course it wasn't that. I didn't get that, but I did give the speech at our graduation, which I was very nervous about. But I succeeded and my husband and I got married in February of 2008.
Carrie Matthews:So four years I was on the job before getting married and starting a family, before getting married and starting a family and, of course, prior to that, you're more. I'm going to go, do what I need to do. I take the risks. I'm not really thinking about the after effects. You're going to chase people, you're going to run with everybody. You're going to do all those things and I didn't stop doing that once I got married and had children.
Carrie Matthews:But I believe after events I would think, oh, that could have went really bad, that could have been a bad decision. You know, you always think about it after the fact, which I still do to this day. I think of everything after the fact instead of during it, because that could get us hurt. But we always worked my husband and I work different shifts, so we were able to do that for our kids and if something went on, we would discuss it with each other, like I've called him at work and ask some advice, or he's called me and ask some advice about you know, report writing or something that happened or a bad call that you were on. We definitely would talk about it. And I've had some amazing partners, which some of them were females. I've been partnered with a lot of females, which is great, but, as you know, people will step up to female officers more than they will step up to male officers. So I guess we would get into it more hands-on sometimes because they would test us.
Carrie Matthews:So it's, it's been. I won't say it's been easy for it with family, but it's. I don't. I don't know any different per se what a normal family is without having a police officer father or without being the mother of it as well. And I'm very hypervigilant and I'm very, I guess, overprotective, some would say with my kids. I'm always looking around, I'm still asking the questions of who is your friends, who are their parents? I check their phones constantly. Social media was a no until just recently, but I check their phones constantly just to make sure, because you never know.
Tyra Valeriano:You never know, and I definitely think that's a cop parent enhanced, because I'm sure all parents do that. I can't say that my parents did that when I was young because social media was not around the way it is now. But, yes, I completely agree with that. You touched on something that I feel a lot of women in law enforcement probably still feel today, and that's proving yourself. Of course, your situation was slightly different than most women. They're probably not doing it to make sure they can prove to their dad or you know the people who have been working with their dad that they can do the job, but just in general, to the department and the agency that they choose hey, I can do this.
Tyra Valeriano:And I feel like that is a really great story to hear from your side, just because you come from a background where this is just something you have in your blood and you're doing it because you're like, hey, dad, I'm going to show you that I can do it. And here you are, 20 years later serving your community. Still, you have a husband in law enforcement and your children have experienced this life that most kids don't have. So it's really great to hear that. And now I'm curious you come with a message, and it's a message that is very relevant to what the podcast is about, and it is about mental health and wellness for first responders. Law enforcement. You have 20 years of experience. I'm sure you have a ton of stories that you could tell if you needed to, but tell us a little bit about why you have such a passion for the mental health aspect in law enforcement.
Carrie Matthews:Well, as I'm sure a lot of us, we've lost friends, co-workers, patrolmen, sergeants, bosses by their own hand, by suicide. I have lost very close friends that are police officers with me by them shooting themselves this past July, july of 2023, I would say July 31st of 2023,. I got the phone call in of 2023, I got the phone call in regards to my dad had taken his own life, that he had shot himself. My dad was a 35-year veteran with the police department. He had been retired since 2009. He was a very strong man, very stubborn, took care of his family, but also had his ups and downs with drinking and things like that With the job. My father was shot on the job in 1988, doing a search warrant in his lake survived it. Search warrant in his lake survived it. He was off a year, which meant that my friends used to call him the warden because I had a curfew. He was very strict on where we had to be, so the warden was home for a year nonstop for me and it was tough for me to be able to go out and do anything. But I understand it now as to why he was the way he was back then Very strict. When I did receive the call, I was very I'm uncertain by it. I didn't believe it because my dad was a gun guy, he was a hunter, he knew his stuff. So I knew it wasn't an accident. I knew it wasn't the old cleaning their gun situation did it. But I also believe that he did not have a plan to do it. I believe that it was just on the fly.
Carrie Matthews:My mom was retired as well. She worked as a Juul bake shop manager forever. She got the job when she was 16 years old, working for Juul, which is a grocery store here, and with it, I would say, the past 10 years. She was battling dementia and Alzheimer's and my dad was her primary caretaker and I would ask him would you like to put her in a home, do you need help? He was very much of the police mentality of I don't want people in my home, I don't want strangers here, I don't trust anybody. Okay, so me working and working in Chicago, days off, canceled, long hours, my husband the same. We did what we could to help, but it was definitely not enough.
Carrie Matthews:I would take my mom out with the kids, I would do things with her again as much as I could, but I believe that it wore on him. I'm sure what wore on him was the 35 years on the job of things that he saw. Times were different. His shooting he had been in multiple shootings, by himself as well, on the job, and I think that taking care of my mom might've just been the tipping point for him. He was not one to talk about his problems, he was not one to complain, he was not one to ask for help. Really, you know, it was the I'll handle it myself, I'll take care of it myself, everything's fine, I'm fine and that's how I was brought up. Like you don't you take care of your business. You don't, you know, act like you can't. The word can't was not okay in my household growing up. It was I can. So I believe that's a big reason as to why he did it.
Carrie Matthews:Him and my son, my father and my son were very, very, very close. My son would go over there constantly. My daughter and my dad were very close. She was also close with my mom both of them and I truly believe we went to Florida for my son's graduation it was his gift and I truly believe that my father did it then because no one was going to accidentally walk in or be there or find him. I don't believe that he would have wanted my kids to find him. My mom went out with her high school friend who happens to be my godmother. They've known each other for 60 something years and she's the one that found my father and had called me.
Carrie Matthews:And again, I didn't believe it. I started to call people to get them to the house. I knew that there might've been firearms around, that I wanted other people to take custody of them Because, again, I think, just like my dad, who's in the house, who's going to be there, who's touching what, I wanted people there that I trusted. I landed up, calling my brother to tell him to get there, and I was trying to get home on the first flight from Florida the next morning, flight from Florida the next morning and even going there the next day into the house, there was no per se crime scene. There was no blood, a little bit of blood on a pillow. There was no note, there was no answers as to why, which, to this day, it haunts me that I have no idea why. And, as police officers, that's what we want to know. We want to know why, who, what, when, where and why, and I don't know.
Carrie Matthews:That morning, around 1230, one o'clock, I had sent him a picture of my son with a Mandalorian in Florida, because my dad would ask for, basically, proof of life for my kids, because it was very hot and he wanted to make sure that they had enough water, they were cooled down and I'm thinking well, you didn't ask me how I'm doing. It was all about the kids. The grandkids were definitely his favorites, and so I sent him a picture and he said oh my gosh, connor looks great. I bet he's having a great time. I said yes, and he said you know, he looks like he's having fun. I said yes, and that was the last day. I am grieving. Every day I don't know why. I get upset, because I want to know why.
Carrie Matthews:Because he was of the type that you would have never guessed it had everything together, always took care of everything, made sure we always had everything wasn't down. He didn't talk about things, he wouldn't say things were rough with my mom, so I had no idea. The typical signs that people say are there were not there at all. He had made plans with my kids my son was starting freshman year, my daughter was starting sixth grade my nephew. It was his birthday the next day. He had had plans with them to do things. So again, it was very off key for me to do it and then to call his friends and tell them and everybody was saying we didn't know or we had no idea. Your dad never said anything. We would ask him things. But it was just very upsetting, to say the least, and trying to move forward with it, because I guess you don't ever know when it's going to come up to you If think like I'm fine and I'm dealing with it.
Carrie Matthews:I actually went to qualify. We qualify yearly and I went to qualify with my gun already suited up. I go out on the line and the first shot that I fired there's tears running down my face and I'm thinking what is wrong with me? You know, like you don't cry at work. That's not professional. And all I thought was that was the last sound my dad heard and it just came rushing. So I took a deep breath, I focused, I got through it and then I just kind of broke down with some of my partners in the car. I said just let me have this right now. It was two guys that were with me. I said just let me have this.
Carrie Matthews:I don't know what's going on, but and they're great but nobody talks about it. Nobody talks about what's happening to you. Nobody talks about how terrible it is, especially as a police officer, because you're supposed to have everything together, you're supposed to keep everything together. We're okay, we're robots, we're not human. We can see this and then go on to the next call. Basically, and I have not stopped speaking about it, speaking about how it's made me feel the past year, how it's made my kids feel, or how you just can't go on, you just don't move on from this. And I've had my own terrible dark thoughts, which is scary, because they say that when somebody in your family kills themselves, you are 50% to 60% higher to do it yourself or somebody else in your family to do it, which scares me to death. So that's why I'm very open about it. I talk to my kids about it, about how I feel, about everything. So they know that this was not the right answer. So they know that this was not the right answer, that there are things happening.
Carrie Matthews:I'm in therapy. I was going twice a week. I've gone to retreats trauma retreat which is a fabulous. It was a fabulous free retreat that literally, I believe, saved my life with this. But there was nowhere for me to turn when this first happened. I was searching for support groups, first responders, support groups with people who in their world has killed themselves. Not just a random support group and I don't mean random by anybody, I just meant first responders because I can't sit next to somebody that doesn't know a police officer's life and explain what goes, what we see, what goes through our heads, and we have the accessibility to handguns and it's so easy. And I didn't want to sit next to a mom where her child did it, because it's just as terrible.
Carrie Matthews:I wanted to be with kind of the same people that knew kind of where I was coming from and still being on the streets or having to talk to people about this because there is nothing, there was nothing around here. There are organizations and you could do Zoom and you could do this, but I wanted a place where I just grab some chairs, get some coffee and talk to other police officers and say how crappy this is and how crappy we feel. Or if somebody is saying, you know, I'm having the worst day, I wish I was gone too, we feel. Or if somebody's saying you know I'm having the worst day, I wish I was gone too. Nobody's going to freak out. They just know that you're having this bad day and let's talk through it and know that we've got your back, we are here for you. No one's pushing you, throwing you into the hospital immediately. We're going to talk through it and see exactly why you're feeling that way.
Carrie Matthews:So this is my goal is to get this started, that I didn't want it to be through the department or through a church, because some people, their loved ones, they may blame the department that it happened or church. You know, I'm not that. I'm not Catholic, I'm not Lutheran. So I was trying to keep it in the middle of just let's go talk somewhere, we don't need anything. I don't trying to keep it in the middle of just let's go talk somewhere, we don't need anything. I don't want to do it at a bar because you know, sometimes sour depression, sorrow, depression and coppers and alcohols would not be a great combination.
Carrie Matthews:And I just like I said, I'm just truthful. I was very angry. I didn't even want to have a wake because I was so angry with him. But I knew, in his 75 years of living, people loved him. People loved working with him. They wanted to pay their respects. My kids had the right to do that, to pay their respects. So of course we did it, but I was very angry there with him as well. I always say my theory is I wasn't enough to keep him here, which that's one of the biggest things that I'm working through, and it's just very, very hard and I want people to know that our line of work is not easy. When you put personal and professional and they come together, it's just sometimes it's just a storm, a tornado in your head of trying to push that to the side.
Tyra Valeriano:Thank you so much for sharing your story. I'm really sorry for the loss of your dad. I can't imagine what you've been through Just based on what you're saying. That is a lot to go through, especially just in the past year. How would you say that this experience has changed your perspective on that mentality that you grew up with? You know, deal with your business, deal with it, and you know, move on, You'll be okay. Do you think that this drastically changed that perspective for you?
Carrie Matthews:I absolutely do think that it has changed my way of thinking, because I took that way of my dad's thinking of what happens in the home stays in the home. We keep everything close to the vest. You don't talk about your feelings, you don't tell people what's going on, you just deal with it and move on, pack it away, pack it away. And then what happens is you explode. And I've had that happen where friends of mine will go out and we'll just talk and I'm crying. They have no idea why that's not fair to them, and so that's why now I'm more of let's talk about it. Let's talk about what's happening. What's happening at home, what's happening in your head, what's happening with your kids, because a lot of people aren't talking about it. What's happening in your head, what's happening with your kids, because a lot of people aren't talking about it. What's happening with the call you went on? That's a lot to take in and to just move past it. There's a call that I have that just it haunts me A three-year-old getting sexually assaulted by her grandfather, and I was fairly new on the job, but I still can see that three-year-old's face and that was one of those times where you think is this job for me? What am I doing? This really happens and there's these people out here that are these monsters. You think about it and before you get on the job you think like, oh, I know, there's bad people, there's bad people, but until you're on the job you don't really see those bad people, until you're in it, and there's no going away from that. And so 20 years of that, or 25 years my dad was on the job for 35 years, 35 years of that and no talking has to take its toll. Has to take its toll. Five years of no talking, people in officer-involved shootings it takes a toll and I want people to know that it's okay to talk.
Carrie Matthews:I am part of our peer support program, but I also know that people don't trust anything that has to do with the department. So, putting that aside, I am willing to talk to anybody at any time about anything in has to do with the department. So, putting that aside, I am willing to talk to anybody at any time about anything in regards to. I might not know what you've, what you've gone through, what you're going through, but I do know what it's like to lose somebody that you've looked up to. That was your hero that you've loved for one day to be there and the next to not be there, and want to know why. And I just I won't stop. I won't stop.
Carrie Matthews:And I've had some people friends tell me you know things that you put on Facebook or things that you say it's a bit much Like, don't you think you should talk to your therapist about that? And my response is always if it's making you uncomfortable, that's exactly why I need to say it out loud. The reason that things are happening are because no one's talking about it. So I'm of the thing of yes, let's talk about it. If it makes you uncomfortable, let's talk about it. It doesn't make me comfortable.
Tyra Valeriano:Right, and that's the stigma that I feel is really at the forefront right now is your dad is a perfect example of. You know, the, the ultimate law enforcement officer, served his career. You know so many great things that you said about him. And later on down the road, it may not be during the career. During the career, it really just settles with people when they're retired and they're having to really just adjust to their life outside of law enforcement and really soak in everything that they've been through.
Tyra Valeriano:And then, of course, there's the issues that are outside of work. Right, you have family situations, you have your own situations and I don't know about you, but I know that I dove into work anytime. I had issues at home and I would just stay busy and work, and work, and work. And that's probably a double-edged sword, because you're going into work knowing that you're going to be dealing with more things that you're going to have to deal with at some point, and then you go home and you're just not really dealing with your issues at home. So it's a really important message to not be afraid to talk about it.
Tyra Valeriano:And my husband and I have this conversation. You know there's this man's man, this appearance or this image, or I don't want to call it a facade, because I do think that there is a role that men play. You know you have to be taking care of the family. There's just this role that men want to have in their family, understandably. But when it comes to talking about the things that you're struggling with, this is where it has to change, and it doesn't mean that you have to hold all that in and this does not just apply to men, it's obviously women too. But law enforcement, in the first responder field, there's so much that the average person will never experience in their entire life, and here we are dealing with it on a daily basis. So, now that you are seeing a therapist and you are a part of the peer support group, what do you think is the biggest benefit that you've seen from taking that step?
Carrie Matthews:So for me expressing that I go to a therapist, I'm not embarrassed by it, I'm not ashamed by it, and for me taking a social media and expressing how I feel, I've actually had more people come to me or send me messages in regards to you know what? I had a plan to kill myself, or I was wanting to do this, or I wanted to do that, or do you have five minutes to talk? I have found that more people now open up about it, because I started the conversation and I'll say, okay, well, did you try this or did you try that? I? I tried EMDR for the first time, which was an amazing thing. Some in this group that I'm in with this retreat, they call it voodoo, bullshit and. But it really worked. But you don't know how it works how it?
Carrie Matthews:works and I'm. It's a I wrap, it's I rapid movement, desensitization, and it's they do something with their fingers and your eyes. You focus on one traumatic event and they keep asking questions over and over how does that make you feel? Or let's go with that. Let's go with that, and it's just something with your eyes and your brain and restructuring it, where the trauma, when you think about it, is still there, but it's not as emotional. I suggest, if you haven't tried it, I definitely would look it up and try it, because it's not amazing. You know it sounds like oh wow, this is, you know the end, all, but it's it helps. It helps to get you through the next step of what you're going to try to heal. It's actually something that I never knew of about. It's not hypnotizing or anything. It's just your brain, your eyes and your way of thinking is changing in the moment of talking with the therapist and your way of thinking is changing in the moment of talking with the therapist.
Carrie Matthews:And I've told people to do that. I've told people to go to this retreat that I constantly am with. I go to it, I help out whatever they need, because I believe in it. I believe in talking about this openness and I know that there are people that are the ones that's saying I'm going to do it, I'm going to do it. They're showing the signs and I'm ready, right there, to step in as well.
Carrie Matthews:My fear is again, the ones where you don't see any signs. It's the, it's the one that's so happy, or they look like they have their whole life together and they don't. And at what? I've told my therapist this and I've, at this retreat I've gone to, I've even said I said I'm the happiest person in the room. I can make everybody laugh, I could talk to everybody. You guys would have no idea that slowly on the inside I'm dying.
Carrie Matthews:And when you come out with the truth of that, and when you come out with the truth of that, then people kind of understand like wait, I'm the same way. You know, like you said, you dive into work a thousand percent because you would rather deal with other people's problems. I'd rather deal with other people's problems and deal with my own. We're fixers, so let's fix it. Show me what, when, when. But then for ourselves, we put ourselves on the back burner and all of a sudden we're just getting pushed away and pushed down, and pushed down until we explode. And then where do you start? You don't even know where to start with talking about your feelings or thoughts.
Tyra Valeriano:Right. I want to go back to what you said about not feeling enough that that crossed your mind because there was no answers and I can relate to you a little bit in this. I've talked about this story in a different podcast, but when I just want to touch a little bit on it because I can relate to what you're saying. My grandfather he was in the army. He retired from the army. He was a very high ranking in the army and I was very close to my grandfather when I was little and I remember when I was about five years old, he was walking into the garage and he told me hey, I'm really sick, and something along the lines that he probably was not going to make it. So I was under the impression that my grandfather had died in the hospital, because after that conversation I didn't see him again. And it wasn't until I was 17 years old that I found out that my grandfather shot himself in the room that I used to live in for my whole entire childhood and he obviously planned this. He thought he was going to do it. He knew he was going to do it. So much to the fact that he told me that.
Tyra Valeriano:But when I became an adult and I, you know, once I was 17 and I realized what actually happened, I'm sure my mom and my grandma went through the same emotions as why, and were we not enough? And there was also no notes. Why, and were we not enough? And there was also no notes. So it leaves you wondering just what exactly it. Maybe it's not one thing, but you're going through your head wondering what the heck happened.
Tyra Valeriano:Well, you know, as a kid, I'm five years old and now that I'm 17 and understanding what did I do?
Tyra Valeriano:Did I do something that he didn't like? And you know my, my grandma, my mom, just all these things are going through your head and it, you know my, my grandma, my mom, just all these things start going through your head and it's, of course, it's not an answer you're ever going to get. So it's like talking to someone is a great way to go about that, because you're never going to get the answer that you want, but being able to express that to somebody and hear that, hey, you are enough, and it wasn't you, you know it wasn't you, but it's the reassurance, because you can't help but think the negative things that pop into your head just from time to time, it's very difficult to deal with. So, with that being said, what do you think is a good way to approach somebody that you work with that isn't showing any signs. You know the happy person. What's a good conversation starter? To check in on the people you work with your partners and make sure that everybody's okay. What do you think is the best way to do that?
Carrie Matthews:So I am a very social person, have always been my whole life and I'll talk to everybody, anybody in the room, you're new, you're old, you've been there, whatever. I will go up to you and I'll talk to everybody. I like to learn about their lives or talk to them about their kids. How's your family, how's your wife, how's your husband, what's going on? And then sometimes I just can see in people I don't know really how to explain it, just they might not have to say it to me just their way they are or how they've been. And I might just ask somebody straight out like, how are you doing? And oh, I'm fine. No, really, how are you doing? Because we're all fine, every police officer is fine, every police officer is okay, every police officer is okay. And then I just kind of will make them uncomfortable with not just going like, oh, okay, you're fine, high five, you know, see, a checkoff, it's more of well, what do you mean? You know, or I know that you're going through this, or I heard that your daughter's sick, or how are you doing? And sometimes that they will open up a little more. But my thing is, with the I'm fine or I'm okay, just question it a little bit further. Well, what do you mean? You're okay, how do you know you're okay? And it's actually come to help me with that and because I like to say that too, like, oh, how are you, I'm fine. And they're like, oh, okay, are you fine? I'm really not fine. You know, they know that. And with the I am, you know, was I enough? I actually got that tattooed on my left wrist. I had a ribbon for suicide on one side and my mom just passed away, august of 2024, from Alzheimer's. So half of it is Alzheimer's awareness and half is suicide awareness. And on my dad's side it says I am enough. Just to remind myself that I am. It wasn't me as much as I will never be sure that it wasn't To remind myself that, no matter what I'm doing in this life, I am enough.
Carrie Matthews:I was raised a not the best childhood, not the worst childhood, but very strict. You know, do as you're told, do this, we don't whine, we don't cry. There was no crying in my house growing up. There was no waiting for things out. It was pretty much what my dad said goes, you don't question him. I don't believe I ever swore in that house growing up, and so that's where I think that I wonder all the time my dad wasn't one never said I love you. So you wonder that.
Carrie Matthews:And now, with my kids, I tell them daily, almost to exhaustion, that I love them. I want them to always know that, and and I tell my coworkers too like you mean a lot to me, and one of my things that I always say to everybody now is your life matters. I don't care who you are, I don't care what you think is happening. Your bills, work sucks you know we all have supervisors that suck things, but your life matters, it's not. This bad moment is going to pass at some point. I'm not going to say with a snap of a finger but things will pass.
Carrie Matthews:And I've even noticed in myself when I'm having a really bad day, if I just take a shower or just walk outside, I'm actually feeling better within that five minutes of. Wow, I was really in the dark over there, but now I'm in the light and I don't want to go to any more suicide funerals. I don't want to have to tell my friends I know what you're going through. I don't want anybody to know what I'm going through and I don't want my kids to ever feel how that feels for somebody else. I think their grandfather and then my mom. It was enough for them. I mean, that's two different ways that they both passed. But for little kids it's very trying and they're still not the same. They're still not the same and I just think that taking the time, sometimes a five-minute conversation, could just change somebody's whole attitude. Or they believe and think that you care and that you really want to know how they are instead of the pass-by in the hall.
Tyra Valeriano:Right, you know, as police officers I will, and maybe you could disagree with me. I'm not sure where you stand on this but there becomes a point where in my career you know you start to dislike people in general and you're not. I've never really adjusted back into being the extrovert that I used to be prior to being in law enforcement. I like people. Now, now that I'm out of law enforcement, I have learned that some of the things that I experienced and that I chose to close off and the perceptions that I have were very skewed because of the job.
Tyra Valeriano:But you know, you do have to make that a skill and you don't have to be fake about it. It's something that if you want to actually make a difference and tell somebody hey, you know, are you okay? And I'm here to take the time to listen, to work on that skill, because we kind of lose that along the way in law enforcement, where we're just hearing everybody's problems, even though we're trying to help them fix it, we end up having just this view of we can't fix people because they keep doing it over and over and over. No matter how many times I try to help them, they don't listen and it gets old and we just kind of stop having this same feeling of caring that we did back when we first became a police officer. Do you feel that that's kind of something that we would have to work on as law enforcement officers?
Carrie Matthews:Absolutely. I joke about it that you know I hate everybody. I hate everybody equally and I don't want to. It's I feel like with this job we see the worst side of people and we see no one's calling us saying, hey, here's some cookies, come to my house. I just made this huge meal for you guys. It's always basically somebody's worst day. That that's why we're showing up, and so we just start to get tainted and our views on people are like oh great, here we go again, this domestic again, and as much as we know, not everything's routine and anything can happen at any moment. You know these people. You're like oh, I hate these people. Can't they just get it together or can't they just move on? And we know in reality when we actually sit and think about it, they can't. That's why they're calling us, that's why they need our help.
Carrie Matthews:But I will say that I am not a fan of groups or crowds or going into restaurants. I definitely do always have my back to the wall so I could see everything that's going on in front of me and very distrusting of people. When people will tell me things, or just somebody walking past saying something to my kids, you know like, oh, I like your shirt and of course in my head I'm thinking oh well, why do you like their shirt? Have you been looking at my daughter? You know things like that where you just what I say. Normal people don't think like that. They just think that somebody walked by and liked your daughter's shirt.
Tyra Valeriano:And I feel like right.
Carrie Matthews:We do need to redirect our thoughts sometimes, because not everybody in the world is bad. Not everybody's out to hurt us, you know. Not everyone's trying to steal my kids, even though they'll bring them right back.
Tyra Valeriano:Yeah, I like to think that too. Okay, you know what if you want, but you know there's keepers, you found it. No refunds.
Carrie Matthews:Yeah, right, but no I agree with you. Disliking of people is yes.
Tyra Valeriano:There was also something that you mentioned about, you know, not wanting to go into the agency for help and I've talked about this a lot too where, as a supervisor, I had a couple officers who did come to me and you know you can only do so much before you realize, hey, where are the resources at, you know? And officers don't want to use what the department or the agency is giving them as a resource because they feel that they're going to pry and they're not safe to talk about what they want to talk about, because, oh, I might, you know, be put on admin leave. What if they don't like what I said? What's going on in my head? They're going to find out, and then there goes my job and all these fears are there. So, now that this experience that you've had, has it helped you, you know, maybe make some connections or networking for the agency, or has the agency stepped in and maybe provided some resources for officers where they don't have to go through a supervisor or human resources?
Carrie Matthews:So, yes, I actually my therapist, I actually use our EAPA, our employee assistance program. I have a great therapist there who's been with me a while, is kind of on to my BS. You know, when I say I'm okay, she's like okay. Or when I all of a sudden feel like I'm, she always says don't disappear on me, don't stop showing up, because we all go through those depression stages, and she, I know, is trying to get the word out about that there is help and that you aren't going to lose your job if you talk, and they do programs, seminars, just like our union does.
Carrie Matthews:I just think that, like you said, anytime people think that they go to a boss at work that they are going to be penalized or pointed out as that's the black sheep of the watch or something like that. But I do believe that that stereotype is changing because more people are going to bosses for help and they are sending them somewhat in right directions. I have some friends, very good friends, that are higher ups, that are all about it and want help. But it takes the person to come up and ask for the help because there are places that you can go that don't have anything to do with the department that are outside the department that you could talk to, and there are a lot of seminars or a lot of retreats, and people will post them and share them in groups, police officer groups or Chicago Police Department groups, and if I've gone to some of them, I'll personally say I went to this and it's not, you know, it's no BS, it's straightforward. They're not going to hurt you, they're not looking to hospitalize you, they're not looking to take your job away. And I think that that's what helps too is word of mouth of people seeking help, no matter where they go, and saying I went there and actually I feel better, or I am getting better, or it did help me, it did work for me, and I think that that helps as well.
Carrie Matthews:And I know that they are doing more trainings for supervisors, but I can't speak of that because I'm not one. More trainings for supervisors, but I can't speak of that because I'm not one, but I Chicago police department has a very high suicide rate amongst the officers, which is very sad, you know, and again, I wish I could stop them all and I wish I could. But I will not stop speaking about it and bringing it, you know, to the forefront of what we're doing, because if one person could say, oh well, carrie said that, or, you know, carrie said I could call her, or she said I could go to this place, or this place is safe, you know what, then what she's saying might be true and I might try it. And if I could literally help one person just change their mindset, then I would feel good about it. I'll feel pretty good about it.
Tyra Valeriano:I agree we are running out of time, but there is a question that I do like to ask all of my guests, and it's based on their experience and what they've just went through in their career. What would be one piece of advice that you would give your rookie self?
Carrie Matthews:Don't take it all home in your head. Don't let it rent space in your head that you have to talk about it, let alone to your partner, your spouse, somebody. But don't try to do it all yourself, because eventually you will explode, and then you're already too far to start with the one thing that was bothering you. You could have stopped it.
Tyra Valeriano:That's good advice. I agree with that as well, and I think that's an important message that newer officers should hear even current officers should hear, and I thank you so much, carrie, for sharing your story, your experience. I completely love your message and I am so sorry for the things that you've experienced over the past couple years. I think what you are doing with your experience is great and I think it's a in addition to what law enforcement needs. I hope that the listeners were able to get some insight on what they can do or where they can go if they are struggling with these same struggles. Is there any contact information that you can share with the listeners in case they want to reach out to you?
Carrie Matthews:So, yes, if they want to reach out to me, I'm on Instagram as shy city girl. I'm on LinkedIn as Carrie Matthews.
Tyra Valeriano:Thank you so much to the listeners. Thank you guys for tuning in. I hope you guys got some valuable information today and if there is one message that you can take away from today, it is to talk to someone, share with somebody what you're going through and just break that stigma. I appreciate your guys' support. Thank you, carrie. Again. Everyone be safe and I will see you on the next one. Thank you for joining me on Chapter Blue. If you enjoyed enjoyed today's episode, be sure to follow and tag me on social media and share with your friends and fellow officers. If you're interested in joining an episode, I'd love for you to be a part of the conversation. Until next time, stay safe, take care of yourself and remember you're never alone in this journey.