Inside The Fight Against Sex Trafficking With Detective Heidi Chance

We sit down with retired Phoenix Detective Heidi Chance and unpack the tactics that actually stop the game of human trafficking. Heidi takes us from her cadet days through years of undercover work to a defining prosecution that ended with 101 convictions and a 493.5-year sentence. She shares with us tips and identifying factors like branding tattoos, when one man is with multiple women in unlikely environments, jail calls to “daddy,” and overly polite traffic stops. We dig into why female undercover officers change the calculus, how expert testimony reframes “choice” for juries, and what it takes to interview victims who love or fear the person exploiting them.

We cover patrol recognition, report details that matter in court, online buyer operations, and the financial playbook that seizes cars, cash, and accounts so traffickers can’t pick up where they left off. Heidi shares  stories about 36-hour rescues, managing family life under callouts, and the growing need for wellness support in high-trauma units. For communities, she points to prevention you can start tonight having real talks with kids about grooming and sextortion, calling 911 when violence happens in public, and resources for tattoo removal and safe shelter.

If you’re an officer scouting a path into human trafficking work, or a leader trying to build capability in a smaller agency, Heidi lays out concrete steps, from shadowing and certifications to assembling a portfolio that wins boards over. If you’re a parent or ally, you’ll leave with clear signs to watch for and the confidence to act. Don't forget to subscribe, share, and leave a review if you liked this episode!

Contact Info: 

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/heidi-chance/ 

Website: https://www.achanceforawareness.com 

Instagram Handle: @a_chance_for_awareness 

Transcript

Meet Heidi Chance & Early Career

SPEAKER_01 0:00

I want to welcome everyone back to another episode of Chapter Blue, and I want to start off by welcoming my guest, Heidi Chance, all the way from Arizona. Heidi has over 27 years of law enforcement experience with several years as an undercover detective, and she is also a subject matter expert in sex trafficking. Before I tell you all of the cool things she's done in her career, I'll let her tell you guys about her background and what she's doing today. So please fill us in, Heidi, on what your background is like and all of the things that you are doing.

Cadet Years And First Patrol Lessons

SPEAKER_00 0:31

Yeah. So I am retired from Phoenix Police Department, where I actually spent 25 years with Phoenix. Hopefully I look like I started when I was 12. You do young? Oh good. I actually started when I was 18. Um, so Phoenix Police Department had a civilian position they started called the Cadet Trainee Program. And um, my dad was also Phoenix PD. He retired after 26 years. And he had come home one day when I was in high school, finishing up high school, and said, Hey, uh, I know you want to go in the military because I was at a school that had ROTC. Um, and so I thought I was gonna go in the Air Force because I knew I wanted to be a police officer. I just had to wait until I was 21, so I needed to do something. So the plan was to do that. Uh, and then um this opportunity came up, and I literally tested in May of 1996, and then by September I was hired and I started working for Phoenix Police Department as a cadet trainee. And this program had originally three. So in my academy class, we had actually it was five. It was five, five of us that were under 21. And um basically we went through like a mini academy, and when we graduated, we were light blue shirt, driving a fully marked patrol car with pepper spray, handcuffs, and a baton, and that's it. And we were supposed to, you know, respond to accidents and dusting for fingerprints and obviously female searches for me. Um, but what you know happens when you see a fully marked patrol car is you get flagged down all the time for things that might be an emergency. So it was a crazy ride for those two years while I was waiting to be uh old enough to go into the academy for realsies. Um and I went in at 20 and a half and graduated three weeks um after I turned 21. So um when I, you know, started my actual career as a sworn officer, uh, I started in, if you've ever been to Arizona in a West Phoenix area. So it was mostly residential, but it was definitely an area of town where you know a lot of home invasions, a lot of drugs, um, non-English speaking individuals, those kind of things. Um, but what it was for me is um, you know, where I started my family, and uh, you know, a lot of young female patrol officers um, you know, go off the desk or sorry, go off the streets and on the desk when you get pregnant. Um, and so in that time I tested for school resource officer, um, which I only planned to do for like a minute because I wanted to get back to patrol. Um, and then I blinked and six years went by. Um but as the school resource officer, and this is where I started my interest in this issue of sex trafficking, was um, you know, we don't get to take the patrol car home. I had to go to the station every day and return the keys. And one day when I was walking into the police station, I noticed a girl who I had remembered from when she was in seventh or eighth grade. On that day, she was still a juvenile, but much older. And I recognized her, she recognized me, and I asked her, Why are you in trouble? Uh, and that's when she told me she was under arrest for prostitution. And it was so matter-of-fact, and I was just shocked like, how are kids getting involved in this? Um, and then uniquely at that same time, Phoenix Police Department had a big case that involved a girl that was held in a dog crate. Um, and she was a runaway juvenile, and the mom had sent patrol officers there to search for her multiple times. And on the third time, they found her, and she was kind of locked in like this waterbed uh, you know, how they're kind of on a platform area and threatened to stay quiet. And she made a noise on the third time that patrol was looking for her and they found her locked in there. So all of that came out around the same time that I started getting asked to do undercover operations out on the street. You know, how I don't know if you ever had the opportunity, but they borrow girls from patrol for fresh faces and things. So um, all of that happened around the same time. And eventually in 2008, there was an opportunity to test for a position. Um, and I tested for position. Back then, the unit was called the Vice Unit. Uh, and basically it was mainly two squads, well, three squads originally, but by the time I got there for real, it was two squads, and it was mostly male detectives. There was only one female position allotted for each squad because at that time, back in 2007-2008, the focus was on arresting prostitutes. All day long, every day, we would go out, misdemeanor arrests. It was the male detectives that was posing as uh sex buyers, and we would arrest prostitutes. It wasn't until we started realizing, and I, you know, have this unique perspective because I evolved with the problem and our response to it, that we started noticing maybe these people are forced to be in this situation. Maybe they're actually victims of a crime. And that's when we evolved into uh where now the squads are mostly female officers because you need to have female undercovers targeting sex buyers and traffickers, which are the real bad guys in this crime. So that's ultimately how the path that I took to get to um, you know, where I gained my expertise in sex trafficking.

SPEAKER_01 6:18

Very nice. So I have a lot of questions, and I I can relate to some of that experience that you had, except I want to say my experience was a little bit opposite of yours. I was one of the fresh face officers back in the day that did undercover work. I was the prostitute, and we were out doing those misdemeanor arrests for those that were going out there and wanting to engage in that. Um, I ended up having to stop because I got a tattoo that reflected that I was a police officer, so I could no longer do that. But uh, what's the real issue versus you know just the people who are going out there trying to get prostitutes? Since you took uh interest in this, what have you, I know that you have something stemming from this uh trainings, concerns about other agencies and the knowledge that officers lack in this area. What's your opinion on that?

SPEAKER_00 7:14

Yeah, so as a uh former instructor at the academy, also, um, I taught human trafficking. And it was one of those things where there was a small block of human trafficking in the academy in 2014 when we first started this training law enforcement to actually look for trafficking. Um, it's expanded now into a two-hour session, but it really wasn't regarded as something that patrol officers really needed to be educated on. Um, I would argue that it is something that they need to be educated on because a lot of times pimps, they're entrepreneurs, they are involved in other crimes, robberies, uh, drug sales, organized retail theft, all of the things that um you know surround the criminal element, just like you know, drug dealers also uh are committing other crimes. So uniquely in 2014, I helped redo that class and um presented it for about almost 13 years-ish. Um, and it's where basically I talk about the crime itself. I found a Facebook live video that a panth made, and I play it to piss off the officers in the academy because he's basically in this video bragging about us not seeing him. So I want you guys to see that these traffickers think you can't see them. And they're also very confident about what they're doing because they have victims, they don't have stolen property or drugs that a canine could find. They have victims. And if the victims that are in the car when you pull it over, um, are very loyal or very scared, they're not gonna open their mouth. And these traffickers are controlling what they say, and if they're not gonna say anything to you as the officer pulling them over, then you're not gonna know that they're being victimized. You're not gonna know that a crime is going on. And the trafficker is probably gonna be super nice to you, which is something that should obviously bother you when they go above and beyond to be super polite, um, and accept their ticket and then laugh as they pull away because they didn't get caught. So very um important for us to see them.

SPEAKER_01 9:30

Yeah, that's those are really good tips. You know, I want to say that from a patrol perspective and an investigative perspective, for the most part, I would say that patrol would look at this as, oh, I'm only I'm only gonna look for the base value of what I might need to identify this. But I feel that patrol kind of stops there and they leave it to the detectives to figure it out. So, what would you say is going above that and providing patrol with the information that they need to be able to progress in their investigation that doesn't need to involve an investigator during that initial contact?

School Policing Sparks A Calling

SPEAKER_00 10:08

Yeah, so just like when I speak to the community, there are certain indicators of sex trafficking. So a big one is the branding tattoos. Um, and it's one of those things that if you are uh responding to uh domestic violence at an apartment complex and inside the apartment you've got a male and three other females, which is also kind of weird. That would be a clue, also. But um, you have those three females. If we separate everybody and they all have the same or similar tattoo, that's a big red flag that these people may all be in this relationship with the same individual that's possibly exploiting them. Um, these branding tattoos are either a symbol or the trafficker's name. I've seen them under the clothing, I've seen them out on somebody's face. It is, you know, it's got two purposes, the branding tattoos. Um, the first purpose is for the person, the victim, to feel a sense of belonging, like you're part of the family, you're part of this, you know, circle of this trafficking lifestyle. I'm gonna take care of you, you're part of something. And the other purpose is to advertise to other pimps, these ones are mine, I own these people. So then that way they don't get snatched up by another trafficker and um you know exploited by someone else because uh then that that there goes my money. So um it the the tattoos are a huge indicator, I would say, for patrol to pay attention to and a document. Um, there's you know, a huge case that I recently did that started from jail intelligence listening to phone calls of female inmates in custody. And each of them would call the same phone number, and that same phone number, when they were on the um call with the male individual on the other end of the line who was out of custody, they would refer to him as daddy, which is also a clue because that's weird that several different females were all calling the same subject daddy. Um, and they were, you know, very careful not to talk about what they were talking about, but you could kind of get the vibe, at least someone experienced listening to these conversations. So jail intelligence contacted me, and I built an entire case based off of going back through prior law enforcement contacts, patrol contacts with these people, placing them together because you you guys are documenting them together, your observations, things that they admitted to, where they were arrested, if they were out in a known area for street prostitution, and you're contacting them and giving them a warning, and you're doing a good job of documenting what they were wearing, dressed to attract, flagging down vehicles with lone mail drivers, all kinds of good documentation. You may not think something of it that day when you're out contacting them three years ago. But me looking at this case, I'm using that as establishing these people have been working for this pant since this date and time because patrol had contact with them out on the blade. Here they are in a traffic stop together, here they are in a DV together. Um, and all of that history really does go a long way to building cases, especially when we go to trial and we have a pant say, I don't even barely know that girl. Yes, you do, because patrol has done a great job of documenting you guys together. So lots of good things, and that's how we build these cases.

SPEAKER_01 13:38

I have an interesting question. Um, it's a little bit off topic, but you did mention earlier that this uh I I guess your agency, my or Arizona's agency that you previously worked in had a unit specific for this, and it was uh it eventually became primarily females. Why is that?

From Vice To Human Trafficking Focus

SPEAKER_00 13:59

Oh yeah. So um Phoenix is a big agency. At least when I first started, we had 3,200 people. I think the other day, and I still get the union emails, we have less than 2,500 people. So we're down like seven, eight hundred cops. Um, but back when I was there and we were flourishing, we didn't have the hiring freeze that we've had um recently, there was enough officers to have specialty units. And so the vice unit, which eventually became the human trafficking unit, um is a dedicated unit just to work human trafficking or prostitution problem, not even where we had to even do any drug stuff. We've got two other squads that do all the drug stuff. We've got a squad over here that does all of the stolen property stuff. Um, you know, so we we were such a big agency, we had enough manpower to have that specialized uh unit. Um, as far as the female officers, again, to target sex buyers and traffickers, you need female undercovers, especially when you have cases, and I've got lots of them, where I've got victims that come forward initially, and they're super cooperative, they want to press charges, but then as time goes by, and all of all of this is because of the justice system. Also, I've had cases take five years to go to trial and resolve. And a victim doesn't want to show up to court, pay for parking, have to see their pimp, and then get uh, you know, the judge and the victim advocate explain to them it's getting continued, and then next month the same thing, and next month the same thing. And so then they bow out and they don't want to participate anymore. So, in order to help stop that, uh, well, not help stop that, but to help also target that trafficker if a victim bows out is to engage with a female undercover. And a lot of that goes on online on social media.

SPEAKER_01 15:55

That's good because um, as you know, obviously it's uh law enforcement already has trouble bringing in females. And then once we come in, the direction that a female officer wants to go in her career, it's a hit or miss for us. So the reason why I asked that specifically is because for any female listeners that are listening to this and maybe they're interested in law enforcement, they're already in law enforcement, this just kind of establishes a route that they might want to take, especially if there's a reason why females are needed in that kind of unit. So that's why I wanted to clarify that. Now, you also mentioned that you started a family, and I want to ask this question because you have been in law enforcement for 27 years, you've had a long, great career, and you have a family. So how does this how do you balance that out with all the cases that you have and everything that you're doing with work and then have your family?

SPEAKER_00 16:53

Yeah, it's definitely hard. I mean, unfortunately, I'm part of the cops who've had uh at least one divorce under our belt. Um uh I only had one one child, my son, he's an adult now. Um, and it was definitely difficult in the early years because uh as uh undercover, typically our suspects are out at night and in late hours. And also as a detective, uh I would get a you know call out because we not only have our regular shift, but we also have the responsibility that if patrol stops a vehicle with a juvenile, we're gonna get called out and do a whole investigation. So it's really hard because I've worked as long as 36 hours before without going home, without taking uh any rest, without sleeping. Because I had a call out. Well, I had worked my normal day. I was actually on the treadmill getting the call from my boss at the end of my day. Hey, we've got this kid. Then I go interview the kid, and then there happens to be another kid back at the hotel that we have to go rescue. And so it turned into a full 36 hours to pursue this trafficker and rescue this other juvenile and get everyone in custody and everyone safe. So, and get all the evidence. Um, so it's very, very difficult to um balance that. But I I think I think most of us are bipolar. I mean, I brag about being bipolar, it's a good thing, just kidding. Um, but we compartmentalize uh our emotions and and things that um we do. And you know, if you I mean, I did have success in kind of breaking up my life at work versus my life at home and and kind of being a different person in both roles successfully. And I think that I manage that pretty well. Um, my son is, you know, a good kid, never got in trouble to my knowledge, never tried any drugs. He's uh 23 now, he doesn't even want to drink alcohol, so that's amazing. And I have to, you know, attribute that to keeping it separate and doing a good job with all of that. Um, but it was definitely not easy.

SPEAKER_01 19:02

Well, congratulations, mama, because that is a great accomplishment, I would say. Um, most kids are bad. Yeah, I I would agree. I had trouble. I have three boys, and one of them gave me hell for a few years. So I definitely get it. Um, so I want to go back to the start of your career in sex trafficking. Is there anything that really triggered you to want to pursue this? Is there anything that really stuck with you that just made you think, you know what, this is where I need to be, this is what I need to be doing?

SPEAKER_00 19:39

Yes, besides the girl that I met early on, with what sparked my interest in the whole first place. Um, I've had an investigation, the one that took five years to go to trial. That case involved seven victims, two juveniles. It was familial trafficking. So it was a trafficker that was pimping out his niece, also having sex with her, and then his 17-year-old stepdaughter. Um, and that case, you know, really taught me how to do these investigations. And I learned so much. Even in the trial, we were doing search warrants of things, um, which is kind of unheard of during a trial. Um, it was a seven-month-long trial. It was 105 counts of child sex trafficking, sexual assault, dangerous crimes against children, harness uh furnishing harmful materials to kids, um, all kinds of charges. Uh, and ultimately the jury found him guilty on 101 out of 105 counts. And it's a record for the United States. He got sentenced to 493.5 years in jail, in prison, um, which is something that I'm super proud about. And I talk about that case all the time to both the community and to other officers to, you know, kind of inspire the outcome that could be if you um, you know, stay with it. It's it's not easy. It was definitely not easy. Um, again, lots of travel for that case. I went to Virginia, to Tennessee, to California multiple times, up to Northern Arizona. But I had an agency that supported going through all of the motions to get to that outcome because this person was truly evil and deserved every second that he got. So that that's definitely inspiring for sure.

Training Gaps And Street Realities

SPEAKER_01 21:30

You know, I had another guest that we briefly discussed sex trafficking and um really online predators and just the way things are today is very, very different than when we were kids. And, you know, I'm not saying it didn't exist because it very much did exist, but we were just so blindsided to it. And now it seems like we're able to learn more, we're able to see this right in front of our face. There there is no hiding, it's just in plain sight. But really. What officers are lacking is just that. It's that training. It's right in front of our faces, but we are not trained to pursue this type of investigation. And I think that is really important. I don't know that all agencies may have updated their uh academy to include two hours worth of a block for this, but I do know personally, I only received maybe 30 minutes if I could remember. It wasn't a huge block. And um I want if I were to think back on all of the cases that I went to, I there was probably a ton of sex trafficking incidents, victims that I just bypassed because I didn't know. So I know you have a training that you provide to officers. Can you tell us a little bit more about that?

Patrol Clues: Tattoos, Dynamics, Intel

SPEAKER_00 22:50

Yeah, absolutely. So I have I was just um sending off, um, I'm gonna um, you know, link up with another organization to be an instructor for them. So I was, you know, counting all the classes. I have 27 classes that I have made, um, where it's it's not just for law enforcement, but also for the community, because I do a lot of outreach to the community because as an investigator and someone who's going to testify that this victim, who I'm calling a victim, is walking down the side of the road with a phone in their hand, and I'm trying to tell the jury that they were not free to leave, they were trapped in this situation. I need a jury to understand that. And so for me, community outreach and having informed public, which equals an informed jury, is huge. Um, that's why I have some of my classes for just the community. But as far as the law enforcement classes, I have a patrol recognition and kind of a response to this problem, you know, seeing it. And when you see it, then what do you do with it? Um, and then I have a class on interviewing. I'm a forensic interviewer, and it's really difficult to get a victim to talk to you because they're loyal to their pimp, they're in love, they've been living on the run. Um, you know, they want to do all the things that their pimp promised them that were going to happen, even though it's probably not happened yet, that they're dangling this carrot and they believe the hype. Um, and it's really difficult to build rapport and get them to talk to you. And so that's a skill that I like to try and um, you know, give to other officers, as far as from my experience, these are the things that worked for me. Um, and then interrogating these suspects, especially as a female detective, we actually, it's a strategy, we we do better in interviews with these pimps because they think they can manipulate us because we're just a female. And so tactically, using a female investigator to interview these traffickers is is also very huge. Um, and then putting these cases together for successful prosecution because these cases, I'm not gonna have a witness that saw this person go have sex with a buyer and then turn that money over to their trafficker. So, how do we prove all of this? And then gathering your evidence and those kind of things and how to testify about um these cases is part of like an eight-hour whole day. And then I have my female undercover school, which is like a four-hour to five-hour thing, um, where I actually talk about, you know, I've been on that couch, I've had my breast grabbed by a sex buyer and then try and jump on top of me. And, you know, hearing it from a female that's actually gone through it is huge because you can see yourself on that couch with that buyer hearing it from me. Um, and it's you know, it's very important to talk to female monsters because it's a scary thing to do female UC work. It's uh, you know, you're in a hotel room with a pimp uh who might be armed and you're supposed to act like no big deal. Right. Um, so yeah, so that's a whole class. And then I have another class that I just recently created where um I'm very excited about it. It's it's based off of the problem with us putting these guys in prison um is that they get back out and they go right back to pimping. I've had four pimps now that I have put in prison, got out and went back to it. And that's because I only based this whole case off of a victim. I didn't go after them in another way. And so now I'm trying to impress upon um officers to go through the extra steps to pursue a financial investigation against these guys so that we can seize their car, we can seize their bank account, and you know, find their storage in it and seize all of their stuff so that when they get out, they can't go back to it. There's nothing left. We've taken it all. And then they won't hopefully choose to exploit another person and go back to trafficking. So lots and lots of classes. I have one on chatting with sex buyers, um, kind of like an online predator uh type of thing. Lots and lots of stuff that I like to do.

SPEAKER_01 27:04

That's a lot of really good accomplishments in your career. I would like to know what you think would be the best advice to give, maybe not only a female, but any male officers that also would be interested in pursuing this in their career. What do you think they would have to prepare themselves with in order to pursue this type of work in their career?

SPEAKER_00 27:27

Yeah, so um I tested twice for the human trafficking unit and got number one twice. And the reason why I tested twice is because I got there and I was there for six months and it was supposed to turn into a permanent position, and we ended up getting sent back to patrol because they eliminated the third squad. Um, and then they didn't need more bodies. So myself and another partner of mine, we went back to patrol, and then it took me a year to test and come back. So, in this whole testing process, obviously it's typically an oral board, and if it's a good agency, it's a practical. And so, in it in you know, preparing for it, I would definitely put in some FaceTime, do some temporary shadows frequently. So then that way you get to know everybody, they get to know you, um, you get to experience this because some people do these temporary assignments and they, you know, don't want to be touched inappropriately by a suspect. They don't feel comfortable with you know getting in a car with a uh not us getting in a car, but a a female um suspect getting in a car with a male detective, those kind of things. So, you know, it's it's it's beneficial for you to do these shadows. And then in leading up to it in patrol, at least at Phoenix PD, we had to have our detective certification. So getting that out of the way and done while you're waiting, because in in Phoenix PD, you you have to wait three years, I think it was three years, so maybe two now, to leave patrol to go to any specialty detail in the whole agency. So you in that two years, focus on your detective certification. Also attend any training you can, conferences, any extra training because you're gonna compete against other people that also want that position. And if it's one training that you attended that you may have gotten some extra education on that could puts you, you know, more points compared to your peer that gets you the spot, those kind of things uh you know mean something. For me, I made an entire binder. I went and had it professionally bound, it had my resume, all the certificates of the trainings I had gone to. I put in there any police reports that I had authored prior to um you know getting there. And during those shadows, I took copies of those, put them in the binders showing my experience, the fact that I have interviewed, you know, victims. I participated in a traffic stop to help rescue a girl, whatever it was, in a bound book. And I made one and I handed one to each one of the people on the oral board. But I might be a little over the top, but that's what it might take to get that position. So um, you know, it's it's uh important to shine in those interviews for sure.

SPEAKER_01 30:15

You know, there's a lot of agencies that don't have this specialty unit, and I can attest to my agency not having that because you know, smaller agencies can't, the funding may be a reason. Um, I mean, there's a ton of reasons why there's not specialty units like this. So if there is officers, let's say you come in contact with an officer who's like, hey, I want to do what you're doing, I want to get the training. Um, how would you advise that officer to present to their agency that even if we don't have this type of unit, uh, we can create something that can do this kind of work in our community because we need it?

SPEAKER_00 30:53

Yeah, sometimes you have to do it and then not necessarily ask for uh um uh what is the saying, do it and then ask for um permission later or whatever the saying is. But sometimes you have to show um the brass that this problem actually exists in our uh uh area of where we um, you know, our patrol area. You have to kind of show them, look, this is existing here for them to see that there's a need um to you know assign a detective to investigate that type of thing. So definitely, you know, still pursue it, still pursue all the training, and you can create a unit in your agency. I've had lots and lots of um, like our organized retail theft, you know, that was created by a sergeant that kept you know getting these big cases, and it was enough where he presented it to you know the chiefs and they decided to create a unit and get him bodies and actually pursue and make that a whole specialty detail. So it can be done for sure.

Building Cases From Small Contacts

SPEAKER_01 32:01

And you are a subject matter expert, so not everybody knows what that is. I'm sure that there has been officers who have done their whole career not really knowing what a subject matter expert is. And I know that in most times there is courses that you have to take, there are certifications, there are a lot of tasks that you have to complete. What was that like for you? And how did you become a subject matter expert in this?

SPEAKER_00 32:28

Yeah, I think a lot of it is obviously the training and the extra education as well as the experience, um, as well as being an expert witness, like deemed by the courts, um, where you've testified as an expert witness in this level of court and that level of court and that level of court. And so I think that's what also you know contributes to it. So uh that is my path that I went on. And so I've actually been asked to speak in federal court and then travel and be an expert witness for the expertise of sex trafficking, and and most of it is for describing the lifestyle. Because, like I said, having someone come in in your trial that explains this is what pimping is for a jury, um, that goes a long way in that jury. After they hear the expert talk, uh, I may not know anything about the case. I'm a blind witness, I'm just talking about the game and the lifestyle of trafficking, and then I leave, and then the jury can have a full understanding when they hear the dis you know the um victim testify of what they went through and why they did what they did and why they didn't leave and all the things. So that is kind of what um is involved in all that.

SPEAKER_01 33:45

What were your feelings like doing your first big case and having to testify in court on that case?

SPEAKER_00 33:51

You know, um, in that trial, that seven-month-long trial, I testified 11 times. Oh wow. Yeah, the main victim, she testified for 18 days against her uncle. And she was in her 20s when uh finally went to trial. So I I think experiencing that made me learn so much about how to do these investigations better. And um, you know, experiencing that also encouraged me to teach because we don't get a lot of classes also in the academy on how to testify or how to, you know, present to a jury or not get flustered by a defense attorney, all of those things. So um that's also part of some of my training. Very nice.

SPEAKER_01 34:37

Uh so you are going to do the ha you're gonna have the female undercover training. And I know we talked a little bit about that before we started our podcast. Uh, what is that going to be? And is that going to be something you're going to do nationwide, or is it only in Arizona?

SPEAKER_00 34:54

Yeah. So the female undercover school, I posted it before I do it virtually and in person. The one on March 21st, I'm doing virtually. Um, and it's literally, I got contacted by Clovis California Police Department, and they said, Hey, we'd love to do a training. We've got 12 female officers that want to do it. So I said, Okay, I'm going to open it up to everyone. So I usually advertise these trainings on LinkedIn. Um, that's where we met. And LinkedIn is uh, you know, really a great place to um for us to network. Um, so that's where I post the training that I do. But like I said, I do um consulting now that I'm retired. I have my own business on the side where not only am I doing these community outreach presentations, but I also do the law enforcement training. And I've had several agencies hire me to do the training and then consult their undercover operation where you know they they want to try it. It's a small agency, it's two agencies working together. Um, I've had a city and a sheriff's office do the training, and then they did an operator operation together based on the training. And it's it's you know, encouraging this pursuit of traffickers uh nationwide. And I've even done international training. Actually, I went down into Mexico and had um my entire presentation translated in Spanish, and um, it was really cool. So um I'm definitely continuing on to do that.

Why Female Undercover Officers Matter

SPEAKER_01 36:24

That's great. Uh, I do have a question about um the training. So if a female decides to take this course and they take it, you said it's five days, right? It's a five-day course. Oh no, about four hours for the female. Four hours. Okay. So if they decide to take that course and they're in a situation that they need your advice or they need your expertise in the middle of the investigation, do they have constant contact to you? Are they able to reach out to you and maybe ask you questions, or do they have some resources that they can use after that that course that they take?

SPEAKER_00 37:03

Yeah, so I've had um again on LinkedIn, I've got a girl from Tennessee that called me. Um, she was out on a call. I always say called me. She contacted me on LinkedIn and she was out on a call and gave me her phone number. And I called her right then and helped her, you know, with her case. I had another female detective that actually she was a female patrol officer that they called in to interview a potential victim of trafficking, and she's never done that before. But they're like, oh, it's a female cop. Let's have a female interview a female with no training. And so I kind of coached her a little bit before she got on and did that interview with the kid. So yeah, I mean, LinkedIn is um a great resource. I'm not on at 24-7. So if I miss you, but if we connect on there and start chatting and, you know, maybe exchange phone numbers, you could send me a text. Like I have um that girl from Tennessee that actually has my personal number, and she texted texts me um a couple of times since that uh call that she was on. I'm absolutely open to that, especially if it's a trafficking situation. I can advise on that. Um, that's that's definitely a goal of mine to you know help you to have a successful case as well.

SPEAKER_01 38:14

The podcast does have a big part on wellness. And where I want to ask you about wellness is going to be for maybe your own experience or maybe investigators or detectives that you've met over the course of your career that have struggled with doing undercover work because just like you mentioned before, there are times that it can be very difficult to deal with being in that world and experiencing things that victims are experiencing and not really being able to talk about it. That's a huge deal because you can't talk about what it is that you're doing. So, how do you deal with that? Is there anything that you can give as far as tips or experiences that you've had in your career?

SPEAKER_00 38:58

Yeah, uh, I think that agencies are doing better now for sure. When I was at Phoenix Police Department, I never had any, we we never had like any counseling or anyone come in and do any wellness training or anyone ask our unit at least if we were doing okay. And you know, that is that is not good, especially for a large agency. I've gone and traveled and experienced other agencies and presentations and conferences where I've seen people come in and talk about their agencies doing that for other officers. And I think that that is amazing because I didn't have that for sure. Um it it was definitely times where I had employed my own counseling through the 12 visits that we get, you know, through our benefits. But um it is getting better, I think, now. Um, as far as managing it myself, I definitely took advantage of those visits sometimes and uh you know, saw my counselor and worked through some of the awful things that I've witnessed, some of the awful things that um victims have described to me as I'm you know sitting across the table from a girl who's got such a bad black eye that is so swollen that I can't even tell if she's looking at me. Um you know, that affects us too, trying to get her justice, listening to her story and seeing her pain. Um, you know, that that definitely is something that uh we need to be able to talk to someone about what we're witnessing as well. Um but I think that agencies are doing better now, and and I'm hoping I'm hoping that it's going to smaller agencies as well, because it's really needed, especially for units like that.

SPEAKER_01 40:49

Is that anything that you address in any of your trainings, uh, even for the the community or the public, not specifically law enforcement, but is there anything that you provide as far as you know resources or you should reach out if this or X, Y, and Z, is there anything that you do talk about when it comes to that?

Balancing Family With On‑Call Life

SPEAKER_00 41:11

Yeah. So when I talk to the community, I talk about resources for um victims as far as shelters. Um, there's an organization that does tattoo removal because the tattoo is a huge emotional thing. And you know, to be out of the life and wearing this pimp's name on your arm or on your breast or on your face and having to see it every day. I mean, that that is definitely something that victims experienced. And so having a resource to remove it or do a tattoo over it, those kind of things, um, I definitely talk about all of that. As far as for officers, um, I talk about, you know, the fact that these programs are available now, uh, the ones that I'm aware of, and um share that information because it is definitely not something that I at least was taught or heard of. And so hopefully by in introducing it in my classes, that is getting to officers that may not realize that's available. Great.

SPEAKER_01 42:13

Well, I know we're running out of time, so I want to know if there is any contact information that you want to share with the listeners. I know that you have your female undercover school, that's one, and maybe your LinkedIn and some other contact or website information that you might have to share with them.

SPEAKER_00 42:31

Yeah, so my um website is called achanceforawareness.com. Um, and basically on there I have my two missions, my community awareness, where I uh presentations on human trafficking 101. I have a modern-day situational awareness class, I have a digital literacy and online safety class for my parents that follow me. Um, I wrote a book called Talk to Them because I feel that prevention in having conversations with your kids about all these dangers and the online world that we live in now is the only way we're going to keep them safe from all of this, because by the time we law enforcement meet you and your kid, the thing has already happened. It's too late. And so, if if parents could be educated on that, I'm actually having it translated in Spanish. I'm supporting a female officer that's in Mississippi, I believe, Missouri. Um, and she's translating my book in Spanish as well as reading it in Spanish, which is a huge help for me, and um you know, is getting to non-English speaking community members that um need to know about our kids, getting involved in these kind of things as well. And then my other mission obviously is my law enforcement training. All of that's also on my website and booking me for speaking opportunities or training opportunities there. Um, and then uh my LinkedIn is under my name, Heidi Chance, and my My LinkedIn game is pretty strong. I love LinkedIn. I uh actually got a job that I have now working in law enforcement for a different agency because of LinkedIn. I was recruited away from where I was when I retired, and they made a special human trafficking unit for me and recruited me off of my LinkedIn, I feel, because that's where they heard about me. So if you don't have a LinkedIn, I would get one and start, you know, focusing on that. It isn't like Facebook or Instagram. It's professional and it's really helpful in your career and in your future. Um, I do have an Instagram. It's also a underscore chance underscore for underscore awareness and a Facebook, a chance for awareness. Everything's under that. Um, and I think that's it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:50

Wow, that's a lot. It's great. I love hearing your story and all of the things that you've done in your career. If anybody wants to buy your book, how can they buy it? Is it audio or is it only paperback? How can they buy your book?

SPEAKER_00 45:03

Yeah, it's on anywhere where books are sold, mainly Amazon, obviously. It's uh right now ebook as well as the print. And then I am going to read it myself to create an audiobook version. And then when uh hopefully in April, I'll get the Spanish uh version and audio uh version of it as well posted on Amazon and everywhere else.

A Landmark Case And Its Lessons

SPEAKER_01 45:26

So I want to tell you thank you again for making time. I think that the message that you have is actually really great, not only just for law enforcement officers to get an idea of what they could be looking out for, the types of cases that they can be investigating, but also for the community to know that it's on the radar, that it's being pushed out, that there is training that is available so that in case there's a victim out there, because I never know who's listening to the podcast, who hears this, that they know that there's a chance that something can come around and help them. I hope that the listeners, if you're in law enforcement and you're interested in pursuing this in your career or getting more training, you guys go to her website, check it out, see what it is that she can offer you because it's definitely needed. I can stay in my area and jurisdiction, I know that we have investigators who specialize in this, but when it comes to training, it's just very, very limited. And I I couldn't even remember the last time that I um had an in-depth training in this area. So I think that it's really important what you're doing. And thank you for all of your expertise and your knowledge. Is there anything that you want to leave the listeners off with? Any tips, any advice that you want to give to them?

SPEAKER_00 46:39

Yeah. Um, well, obviously uh for anyone non-law enforcement listening, um, a lot of people are afraid to get involved, you know, with calling in, calling the police. You don't have to have the patrol car come to your house. You can leave information on the phone, provide your contact information so we can call you back. And, you know, maybe you witnessed something else, maybe you saw them with someone else, um, you know, something that you forgot, but give us the uh opportunity to ask you more questions. But um, you know, in this situation specific to sex trafficking, I've had so many victims say, you know, they were at a bus stop in broad daylight getting beat up by their pimp and no one did anything. And so um we need to get back to not breaking out your phone to film a TikTok, but breaking out your phone to actually call the police and help this person. So um that is what I would leave you with.

SPEAKER_01 47:37

All right. Well, thank you so much, Heidi, to the listeners as always. Thank you guys for the support and for tuning in. Be safe, and I will see you guys on the next one. Thank you again, Heidi. Thank you for joining me on Chapter Blue. If you enjoyed today's episode, be sure to follow and tag me on social media and share with your friends and fellow officers. If you're interested in joining an episode, I'd love for you to be a part of the conversation. Until next time, stay safe, take care of yourself, and remember you're never alone in this journey.